Somebody told me this story about a mother who gave birth a hospital at MCU in Caloocan where her baby was delivered. The mother just had her 8th (or 9th) baby and that she just had tubal ligation as recommended to her by the doctor and to which the mother had gladly accepted the procedure. The mother didn’t really want that many babies but didn’t know what her options were until told by the doctor. (I say kudos to that doctor!) The mother was in her early 30s so we can say that at the pace she was delivering souls into this world, she could still deliver four or five more babies if not sterilized. The mother was ignorant about her choices. Also, tubal ligation is a safe procedure and is very effective.
The consolidated reproductive health and population bill (substitute bill to HB 4110 now filed in the current 14th congress) mandates some basic things to be in place, a structure, a program and an assured budget allocation towards promoting choice on reproductive health, for informing our women about their choices and providing the necessary and non-discriminatory access to these choices. This the government cannot do now because it’s not automatic and the Church leaders are opposing these programs each time the national government attempts to put something in place. Only if we have people like Juan Flavier running DOH can get things done even partially effectively and only while it lasts. The Church leaders don’t speak for the belief of its flock but they are the most influential with some bishops even threatening denial of communion (an absurd threat in this time and age except when made to a sagrado Katoliko types) to the lawmakers who support the bill. It’s a relief that we no longer live in the times of Rizal where the church and state is one and the same and where opposing the church/state can lead to a speedy mock trial and an execution.
The Catholic leaders just like many among us are ignorant about many things specially on issues on population. This ignorance is a product of our low-quality educational system which is in turn is a part of our low-quality-educated society. Unfortunately, again the Catholic Church plays a big part in this collective ignorance since there are many “high-quality” private schools run by religious institutions in the country that is short-changing our future by faithfully educating the people with religious BS but at the same time selectively teaching biological sciences to produce a population with collective ignorance of Charles Darwin’s contribution to the sciences. One cannot appreciate the real danger of the world with limited resources on the brink of collapse because the gradual manner that it is happening is hardly noticeable on a day to day basis. What’s worse is ignorance of the accelerating pace of this environmental collapse due to the damage caused by unsustainable population growth helped brought about by irrational policies. This reproductive health bill is one of the things that should help us stem the tide of population growth if enough mothers can be informed of their choices and be able to avail of these choices. Even with a steady population growth with sustainable development has environmental consequences in the form of rising demand on the limited resources the planet could offer.
One major objection by the moralist crusaders about the bill is that it will encourage promiscuity. Hello? They are really in the Dark Ages. They cannot stop what is already there. Many people are already having sex before and outside of marriage and with multiple partners. They no longer need encouragement. In fact, presumably many priests and bishops have presumably had sex at one time or anotheer so I don’t subscribe to the insinuation that they lack the experience on this matter. But if two consenting adults have sex and if all parties involved consented, what possible business do the priests and bishops have in it? Another objection is that the bill will legalize abortion. The latest bill is even more explicit in stating that it will not. Another objection is because of they say, “we don’t own our body”. That is of course a complete religious bullshit.
Catholics should be free to think and come to the conclusion by themselves. The church leaders are just as ignorant and fallible about many things and so don’t have the authority on truth. If history will be the basis, the Catholic hierarchy has even a very poor record on this regard, specially where science is concerned. (For example, the Catholic church has not yet fully acknowledged evolution as true.) The thinking that priests and bishops and popes and pastors know best is a sure ticket to being misled, hopefully without getting your money. This include the truth on reproductive health and population issues that should be debated freely and without coercion (e.g., no threat of any kind like from organized religion) based on empirical facts.
Finally, the non-Catholics should be able to avail of their medical choices without the Catholics refusing them.
” If history will be the basis, the Catholic hierarchy has even a very poor record on this regard, specially where science is concerned. (For example, the Catholic church has not yet fully acknowledged evolution as true.) ”
Evolution until now is a theory.
In history there is no other organization that pushed for the advancement of research in science other than the Catholic Church. Let us not forget, just to name a couple, of the father of genetics- a catholic priest Gregor Mendel and another catholic priest who formulated the heliocentric theory later on defended and advanced by Galileo- Nicolaus Copernicus.
Science and religion are not to be pitted against each other.
Pope Benedict XVI encourages the scientists on one of his visit to the Pontifical Academy of Science, “Christianity does not posit an inevitable conflict between supernatural faith and scientific progress…”
“Scientists will find support from the Church in their efforts to confront these issues, since the Church has received from her divine founder the task of guiding people’s consciences towards goodness, solidarity, and peace.”
“Our world continues to look to you and your colleagues for a clear understanding of the possible consequences of many important natural phenomena. I think, for example, of the continuing threats to the environment which are affecting whole peoples, and the urgent need to discover safe, alternative energy sources available to all.
Precisely for this reason, the Church is duty-bound, to insist that science’s ability to predict and control must never be employed against human life and its dignity, but always placed at its service, at the service of this and future generations.”
dude, you must have read history written by the Catholics.
Saying evolution is just a theory is short-changing yourself. The whole of biological and social sciences can only be understood in the light of evolutionary theory.
On science and religion. It cannot be avoided. Science is showing that many religious “truths” had been just “untruths”. Saying there is no conflict “between supernatural faith and scientific progress” is just stating the obvious. Scientific progress is real and materialistic while there is really nothing that can be called supernatural (there is only our ignorance of the natural) so there cannot be any conflict except in the mind.
Funny thing is, to walk the talk, the Church should publish the explanation why water can turn into holy water or bread into body and wine into blood or how did they detect purgatory, or how do they certify miracles. Catholic has a lot of BS that is in CONFLICT with science. It should start there.
Actually, the Catholic Church has a lot of things that are in conflict with just common sense. That’s why you need your indoctrination on truth with the threat of punishment for doubt because its truth cannot stand as its own authority.
vWe can always agree to disagree.
The truth of the matter is that there really are questions that science cannot answer e.g. the purpose of life, etc…, not because of anything else but simply it is not appropriate.
To follow your reasoning is like expecting science to come up with a chemical make-up of, let’s say, aetheism.
It is like asking for a mathematical explanation on subjects of biology, or trying to prove an algebraic expression using concepts of anatomy.
Science and religion are two different subjects, they are not to be pitted against each other.
what you are accusing religion of doing is exactly what you are trying science to do.
Religion leaves to science what it does and can do based on its ability and capability and obviously need to reclaim from science when science begin to try to explain what is beyond its scope and reach. So shall science should behave the same way, leaving to religion the business of religion.
Miracles become miracles when they defy any scientific explanation. As simple as that.
What you are saying in all that you said here is a classic example of refuting not the Church but your misconception of what the Church is.
Before anything else, one must understand what religion is before one can truly refute it. Understanding first what you are against with -It should start there.
You cannot avoid religion and science clashing because the church have existential truths that are within the real of science. I agree with you on the limitations of science when it comes to certain questions but I am not saying those questions lie within the realm of scientific inquiry. Existential/material claims are within the realm of science and when the church make such assertion, it will be challenged by inquiring minds. Religion should not be exempt from it because as history has shown, many truths claimed by religion have been found by science to be untruths.
Miracles happen when it defies scientific explanation because our knowledge is insufficient. In short, miracles happen when we have ignorance.
Religion and science clash when there is misconception on the premises that each operates on.
The Catholic Church recognizes and in fact calls on science to know greater things and understand the world more. Last 2003 the Catholic Church celebrated the 400th anniversary of the Pontifical Academy of Science. http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_academies/acdscien/index.htm
As a Catholic myself, I am sorry but i cant help wondering why people still think that religion (Catholic in this regard) is trying to compete with science.
In regards to Miracle, there is a big difference between insufficient knowledge and ignorance. Insufficient knowledge is failure of the mind to comprehend or provide an explanation; not through laziness or some decision to not notice but simply a knowledge that is not available yet or the mind has not reached any explanation yet.
Ignorance is a condition of knowing something but refusing to acknowledge it; it is when knowledge is available but the person guilty of it decides to not take notice or not accept it.
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evolution is a scientific theory that is back by empirical evidenvce.
it is not the vernacular? theory that is based on suspicion/ speculation
yo! wat’s that?? wew